The New Music Business with Ari Herstand

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This week on the New Music Business podcast, Ari sits down with Justin Gammella, a hit songwriter, producer, top liner, and multi-instrumentalist based in Los Angeles. With over a billion streams to his name and more than 100 released cuts, Justin’s catalog includes Bella Poarch’s viral hit “Build a Bitch” and collaborations with artists like Benson Boone, Lennon Stella, Steve Aoki, and FINNEAS. A true “working class” pop songwriter, Justin brings a decade of professional songwriting experience to the table and is also the host of the Producer Points podcast.In this episode, Ari and Justin dive into the realities of professional songwriting in today’s music industry. They explore how songwriters get paid, how publishing works, and the controversy around non-writing artists receiving songwriting credit. They also touch on newer developments like songwriters earning master points and how the industry continues to evolve in the streaming era. This episode also takes on the growing role of AI in music—how Justin uses it in his workflow, the ethical questions it raises, and the need for safeguards across the industry.https://instagram.com/justin_gammellahttp://instagram.com/producer_points Chapters00:00 The Role of Songwriters in the Music Industry05:12 Journey to Becoming a Professional Songwriter10:04 Understanding Publishing Deals17:30 Monetization in the Streaming Era23:15 The Songwriting Process and Collaboration31:54 Vocal Production: The Heart of Music Creation39:08 The Art of Pitch Songs: Collaboration and Emotion42:17 Navigating the Modern Music Landscape: Major Labels vs. Indie Artists45:57 Songwriting Credits: The Controversy of Co-Writing50:11 The Evolving Role of Songwriters in the Streaming Era54:56 AI in Music: Opportunities and Ethical Considerations01:01:36 Defining Success in the New Music BusinessEdited and mixed by Ari DavidsMusic by Brassroots DistrictProduced by the team at Ari’s TakeOrder the THIRD EDITION of How to Make It in the New Music Business: https://book.aristake.com Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week on the New Music Business podcast, Ari sits down with Oscar Höglund, the co-founder and CEO of Epidemic Sound. Epidemic Sound is a leading music and soundtracking platform for content creators. They have garnered attention for its digital rights model and soundtracking tools that help creators to elevate their content with music, while simultaneously supporting artists financially. Oscar shares insights from his journey launching Epidemic after working with Sweden’s renowned Zodiak Television.In their episode, Ari and Oscar unpack critical issues impacting independent artists, including royalty structures, streaming economics, and the evolving landscape of music licensing. They explore Epidemic Sound’s unique approach to artist compensation, discuss how digital streaming has pushed music toward playlist-driven consumption, and tackle the creative tension artists face when making commercially viable music. This episode offers an in-depth look at one of the industry's most influential platforms shaping the future of music in content creation.Chapters00:00 The Changing Landscape of Music Royalties06:00 Epidemic Sound: A New Model for Music Distribution12:14 Artist Compensation and Ownership Rights17:46 Innovative Approaches to Music Licensing24:09 The Impact of Epidemic Sound on Independent Artists29:53 Future of Music in the Digital Age42:16 The Evolution of Music Consumption46:21 Negotiating with DSPs and Licensing Rates49:52 The Rise of Epidemic Sound55:31 The Artist's Identity Crisis01:08:01 Future Innovations and AI in Music01:21:12 Becoming a Full-Service Music PlatformEdited and mixed by Ari DavidsMusic by Brassroots DistrictProduced by the team at Ari’s TakeOrder the THIRD EDITION of How to Make It in the New Music Business: https://book.aristake.com Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week on the New Music Business podcast, Ari sits down with Jaclyn O’Connell, a digital marketer, creative strategist, artist manager, and founder of Bittersweet Media and Good Grief Management. Jaclyn has provided creative marketing solutions and hands-on artist management for artists and labels of all scales and sizes—from emerging artists to well-established acts and both indie and major labels. They have supported gold and platinum records and worked with artists including Wild Rivers, Cavetown, Julian Baker, and Cold War Kids. Drawing on experience in both marketing and artist management, Jaclyn offers a sharp, insider perspective on what it truly takes to build a sustainable career in today’s music industry.In this episode, Ari and Jaclyn dive deep into the realities of modern music marketing — from navigating ever-shifting social media algorithms to building effective fan funnels that turn casual listeners into ticket buyers and lifelong fans. They also unpack the current touring landscape, direct support deals, and the hot-button issue of tour buy-ons. Whether you're an artist, manager, or just curious about how fan engagement really works, this is a conversation you won’t want to miss.http://instagram.com/jaclyn_oconnellChapters00:00 Building Direct Relationships with Fans03:09 Navigating the Social Media Landscape05:49 The Importance of Mental Health in Artist Management09:05 Innovative Monetization Strategies for Artists11:55 The Role of Community in Artist Growth14:58 Understanding the Fan Journey18:05 Challenges in Touring for Emerging Artists21:03 The Evolution of the Live Music Industry36:21 The Ethics of Tour Buy-Ons39:09 Navigating the Challenges of Touring43:05 Building Artist Relationships and Mental Health46:04 Defining Success in Artist Campaigns48:02 The Role of Social Media in Driving Streams51:01 The Nuances of Going Viral55:29 The Fragmentation of Viral Success57:23 Conversations with Labels and Ownership01:01:23 Balancing Management and Business01:10:25 Setting Boundaries in Artist ManagementEdited and mixed by Ari DavidsMusic by Brassroots DistrictProduced by the team at Ari’s TakeOrder the THIRD EDITION of How to Make It in the New Music Business: https://book.aristake.com Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week on the New Music Business podcast, Ari sits down with Danny Ross, a producer/songwriter, columnist at Forbes, professor at Berklee NYC, and the founder of the largest songwriting camp in the world, Anti Social Camp. Now in its 5th year, Anti Social Camp brings together over 250 songwriters, producers, and artists, including Cigarettes After Sex, Beach Bunny, Bryce Vine, Walk the Moon, Taja Kumari, Evan Giia, and Louis Cato, for 200 recording sessions across 40 studios in 5 days.If you are a songwriter or producer who’s ever wondered what goes down at songwriting camps or how to get involved, you’re going to learn all about that and more in this episode with Danny Ross.Get $100 your Anti Social Camp Badge by using the code: ARIANTISOCIALVIP at antisocialcamp.comChapters00:00 The Importance of Reputation in the Music Industry03:02 Understanding Songwriting Camps05:48 The Structure and Dynamics of Songwriting Sessions08:47 The Evolution of the Anti Social Camp12:01 Building Community in New York's Music Scene14:54 The Anti Social Camp Experience17:54 Diverse Genres and Collaboration20:54 The Future of Songwriting Camps31:11 Creative Collaborations in Music Production32:26 Success Stories from the Camp33:44 Understanding Major vs. Indie vs. Self-Releasing Artists38:33 The Financial Landscape of Music Production44:53 Navigating Splits and Royalties in Music47:01 The Ethics of Publishing in the Music Industry52:39 Teaching the Next Generation of Music Creators56:40 The Importance of Community in Music Creation59:01 Defining Success in the New Music BusinessEdited and mixed by Ari DavidsMusic by Brassroots DistrictProduced by the team at Ari’s TakeOrder the THIRD EDITION of How to Make It in the New Music Business: https://book.aristake.com Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week on the New Music Business podcast, Ari sits down with Dan Melnick, the General Manager of Bandcamp. One of the earliest direct-to-fan platforms, Bandcamp empowers listeners to support artists they love directly. They have enabled fans to pay over 1.49 billion dollars and 193 million dollars directly to artists last year. Over 75k records get sold on this superfan platform every day and over half a million fans buy at least one thing on Bandcamp each month. In this episode, Dan explains to Ari how and why Bandcamp is still growing after 17 years. He shares where the company’s headed, and why its download model has continued to thrive, despite the fall of downloads on platforms like iTunes. Dan also highlights how artists can use Bandcamp to bolster their release strategies, and Ari shares some of his favorite, lesser-known features of the site. Take a listen to find out how Bandcamp’s direct-to-fan platform can help you connect with fans and monetize your fan relationships.https://bandcamp.com/ Chapters00:00 Building a Sustainable Music Career05:00 The Power of Bandcamp09:59 Understanding Bandcamp's Growth15:06 Direct-to-Fan Relationships19:53 Innovations in Bandcamp24:45 Community and Engagement on Bandcamp30:03 Best Practices for Artists on Bandcamp36:25 Merchandising Beyond Music: The Power of T-Shirts39:28 Navigating the Streaming Landscape: Bandcamp vs. Spotify48:25 Building a Sustainable Career: Strategies for Artists56:11 Understanding Bandcamp's Business Model: Fair Trade Music01:02:36 The Evolution of Curation: Bandcamp's Editorial Approach01:05:20 The Future of Bandcamp: Building Sustainable CareersEdited and mixed by Ari DavidsMusic by Brassroots DistrictProduced by the team at Ari’s TakeOrder the THIRD EDITION of How to Make It in the New Music Business: https://book.aristake.com Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this solo episode of the New Music Business podcast, Ari untangles the complexities of royalties, registration, and publishing. After his social media video with the same message (“Don’t cut your drummer into publishing”) went viral for the wrong reasons, Ari wanted to come on the show and break down the nuances of this advice. Tune in to get clear on the differences between publishing royalties and master royalties, which royalties session musicians are legally due, the importance of one-stop agreements, and how to fairly (or, more so, generously) compensate your session musicians.Read the article on Ari’s Take: https://aristake.com/publishing-royalties/Chapters00:00 Understanding Music Publishing and Royalties02:55 The Role of Session Musicians in Music Creation05:55 Differentiating Between Master Royalties and Publishing09:09 The Importance of One-Stop Agreements11:59 Fair Compensation for Session Musicians15:12 Changing Industry Standards17:46 How Publishing Royalties Work Within Bands20:13 Why Session Musicians Are Not Considered Co-Writers22:20 Legally Entitled Radio Royalties for Session MusiciansEdited and mixed by Ari DavidsMusic by Brassroots DistrictProduced by the team at Ari’s TakeOrder the THIRD EDITION of How to Make It in the New Music Business: https://book.aristake.com Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week on the New Music Business podcast, Ari sits down with Jacob Paul, the VP of Platform Growth & Brand Strategy at Kobalt and KOSIGN. Jacob has been one of the leaders behind Kobalt’s new admin publishing platform, KOSIGN, since its public launch in February 2025. Kobalt has been disrupting the traditional publishing model for years. Now their application-based platform, KOSIGN, is doing the same in the admin publishing space.In this episode, Jacob explains how Kobalt and KOSIGN approach publishing differently than traditional publishers and admin publishers. Along the way, he and Ari completely break down how music publishing works. They touch on: how songwriters get paid, the difference between “artists” and “songwriters,” the difference between publishers and admin publishers, and how creators can be sure they’re not leaving any money on the table. Jacob also shares why it’s advantageous to have a publisher or an admin publisher instead of just working with a PRO or MRO. If you have questions about music publishing (and let’s be real, who doesn’t?), this episode’s got you covered. https://www.kosignmusic.com/ Chapters00:00 Understanding Music Publishing and Royalties05:07 The Role of Kobalt in Music Publishing10:10 Distinguishing Between Artists and Songwriters14:51 The Importance of Publishing for Songwriters19:53 Kobalt's Innovative Approach to Publishing25:03 Exploring Traditional vs. Admin Publishing Deals29:56 The Launch of KOSIGN and Its Impact on Indie Songwriters35:43 The Rise of Independent Artists40:23 Understanding Publishing and Royalties45:35 Navigating the Complexities of Publishing Administration51:10 The Role of KOSIGN in Empowering Songwriters56:25 The Future of Music Publishing and Artist OwnershipEdited and mixed by Ari DavidsMusic by Brassroots DistrictProduced by the team at Ari’s TakeOrder the THIRD EDITION of How to Make It in the New Music Business: https://book.aristake.com Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week on the New Music Business podcast, Ari sits down with Mag Rodriguez, the founder and CEO of the direct-to-fan platform EVEN. Throughout his career, Mag has helped artists generate over 1 billion streams—but now, he’s focused on building a parallel music economy where artists sell directly to fans before streaming. “Superfan” platforms like EVEN are redefining how artists monetize their work.Through EVEN, Mag has partnered with J. Cole, 6LACK, LaRussell, Lauren Jauregui, Fariana, Smino, Ryan Leslie, and thousands of other artists of all levels, empowering them to take ownership of their fan relationships and unlock new revenue streams. They’re essentially putting control and earnings back into the hands of artists.In this episode, Mag tells Ari about artists who don’t have many followers or monthly listeners, but are making significant revenue from their fans on EVEN. They discuss the previous eras of direct-to-fan platforms (like Bandcamp, Patreon, Kickstarter) and how EVEN’s music-centric model differs from these prior iterations. Superfan platforms are truly taking the industry by storm—Mag tells Ari that EVEN, alone, onboards about 8,000 artists each day. If you’re interested in exploring superfan platforms, this episode is a great place to start. Check out EVEN at: get.even.bizChapters00:00 The Challenge of Monetizing Music for Emerging Artists02:57 The Rise of Direct-to-Fan Platforms05:58 Understanding Even: A Direct-to-Fan Platform08:55 Windowing and the Shift in Music Distribution11:54 The Economics of Music Sales vs. Streaming15:12 Selling Access: The Community Aspect of Even18:00 Building Community: The Even Triangle21:04 Real Success Stories: Emerging Artists on Even24:00 Emotional Commerce: Connecting with Fans26:57 The Future of Music Monetization35:10 The $1,000 Album Phenomenon38:36 Sustainable Revenue Models for Artists40:16 Data-Driven Insights for Artists44:27 The Journey to Building Even51:12 Navigating Major Labels and Independent Artists54:23 Operational Framework for Artists and Labels01:00:07 Community Engagement and Fan Interaction01:04:24 Defining Success in the New Music BusinessEdited and mixed by Ari DavidsMusic by Brassroots DistrictProduced by the team at Ari’s TakeOrder the THIRD EDITION of How to Make It in the New Music Business: https://book.aristake.com Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week, Ari is joined by Lyor Cohen, the Global Head of Music at YouTube. Earlier in his career, Lyor led Def Jam Recordings, where he worked with artists such as Jay-Z, Ja Rule, and Ludacris. He eventually sold Def Jam to Universal and helped create the Island Def Jam Music Group. After Def Jam, Lyor became Chairman and CEO of Recorded Music at Warner Music Group. He went on to co-found 300 Entertainment (repping artists like Fetty Wap and Young Thug) before landing at YouTube in 2016.In this episode, Lyor and Ari discuss artist development, the state of the industry, and music’s digital revolution. Lyor shares what it was like to lead Warner Music at a time when both Spotify and YouTube launched. If you’re curious about the trajectory of tech in music, how generative AI can bring artists and fans together, or how you can use YouTube to build momentum in your career, this episode is for you.Chapters00:00 The Pursuit of Artist Success05:23 Navigating the Music Industry Landscape12:11 User-Centric Approach in Music20:34 Building Artist Communities27:14 The Evolution of Music Consumption33:30 Embracing Generative AI in MusicEdited and mixed by Ari DavidsMusic by Brassroots DistrictProduced by the team at Ari’s TakeOrder the THIRD EDITION of How to Make It in the New Music Business: https://book.aristake.com Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.